Kyle deals with some of the perverted, disgusting, and destructive passages in the Bible, reflects upon religious zealotry and terrorism, and may get into some of the occult crafting of religious constructs. Special guests and callers might stop by to weigh in on these issues.
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Heathen faggots. All you do is try to divide white people from their semitic religion. What the fuck is wrong you?
ReplyDeleteGreat show Kyle. Keep the pressure ON.
ReplyDeleteGo Kyle!
ReplyDelete.
ReplyDelete.
Another anti-Christian podcast?
Another christian upset about a non-christian radio network talking about religion?
ReplyDeleteThe Ginger warrior talking satan again....
ReplyDeleteRentafags, you fucks cant even get 200 people to sign your petition, yet you want to keep dividing the people among belief lines, how wise of you.
Christianity already has 40,000 divisions. And you guys want to divide it more?! Take your "white religions" somewhere where they do butt sex. We're fine with our semitic bible. It makes the most sense.
ReplyDeleteThese scumbags only religion is antichristianity, started by talmudic jews 2000 years ago.
ReplyDeleteThese antichrist butt boys are a joke. White people are nothing without Jesus Christ.
ReplyDeleteDo you retards even know what a semite is? It's a pretty broad group of people, unless you use the jew definition. For some strange reason you morons seem to prefer to let jews define reality for you.
ReplyDeleteSemites are described as the people inhabiting the area that was the birthplace of civilization. You people not only attribute Christian civilization to jews, but all of civilization itself. I can't help but think you're either jewish, or the dumbest bastards on the planet.
I have met non jew semites myself that nobody would mistake for anything other than white.
Aryans created civilization in the middle east. Semites are jews and arabs. Even khazar jews have semitic DNA, they were a migration of sephardic jews that mixed with germans, slavs and mongols after the Romans scattered them like cockroaches in 70 AD.
ReplyDeleteButt boy pagans. I think its clear you rentafags are beyond the help of Jesus Christ. Good luck burning in hell with all the other antichrists. Heaven is only for those that accept the King of the Jews.
ReplyDeleteWow. It is utterly amazing that so many uncritical defenders of Christianity resort to language that betrays an overwhelming fascination with homosexuals and anal sex when they attack their critics.
ReplyDeleteHilarious.
It's also pretty funny that so many of these manly Christians, who are so proud of being members and protectors of the White race, so often express utter contempt and hatred for White women. How does that work, fellas?
Misogyny, a fixation on "butt sex," a clear and ever-present loathing for reason and humanity in general...
Let's face it, boys. You may as well be Jews.
It's a fact that the antichristian movement was jewish from the start 2000 years ago, you retards are just their newest allies. It's a fact that the antichristian movement draws homosexuals and other social and moral degenerates. These are your allies, you chose them nobody chose them for you.
ReplyDeleteTake your fancy words and shove them up your ass, pagan butt pirate. And why are you guys so against jews? There are plenty of good jews. Jesus being one of them.
ReplyDeleteJesus was a cool dude. We was a Jew but he was a troofer like us.
ReplyDeleteSort of like a 2000 year old Bob Tuskin.
Whoever is doing the derogatory Christian point of view thing, it doesn't work for you, you're just not smart enough to pull it off.
ReplyDeleteWhat the fuck are you talking about christard?
ReplyDeleteyou're just not smart enough. i keep waiting for something clever out of you clowns, but the best you can do is annoying. this ploy isn't even annoying.
ReplyDeletei mean really most of it doesn't appear very antichristian at all, most people probably won't even get it. only a few people read this crap anyway
ReplyDeleteLugh, are you drunk? Is that you talking to yourself?
ReplyDeleteWhy would i worship some JEW that was against the money changers!?
ReplyDeleteWhy should i see him as a god!?
Why should i accept the jewish religion as mine!
There are some JEWS today that are against the JEWISH USURY and CONTROL,,SO LETS ALL START WORSHIP THEM AS A GODs!!
I am not PAGAN but also not a IDIOT THAT BELIVES IN JEWISH HISTORY AND MAMBO JUMBO!
Why do people belive in some jew in israHELL that was a rebel against money changers and view him as a GOD!
White Europeans exist much longer then this FILTHY fairy tale!
LETS ALL START WORSHIPING GILLAD ATZMAN or BENJAMIN FREEDMAN AS A GOD,WHAT DO YOU THINK ABOUTH THAT!!
BRAIN DEAD ZOMBIES!!
Anonymous said...
ReplyDelete...the best you can do is annoying. this ploy isn't even annoying.
April 30, 2013 at 2:54 AM
Huh?
I don't care about white people. Let the jews have you sonofabitches.
ReplyDeleteWow you can tell the retards that post comments here never debate the issue they just attack!!
ReplyDeleteThe buybull Is a book writin by men for weak minded fools who thinks that there is a Jewish paridise in space called heaven once you die.
9:23 AM
ReplyDeleteThese is nothing to debate about. I dont care about bible and i dont care about you too.
nobody listens to retard radio, even antichristians don't want anything to do with you. maybe if you talk about fashion or interior decorating, you'll get the "pagan" audience.
ReplyDeleteRentapagans are just wirst cutting, basement dwelling Slipknot fans.
ReplyDelete:D
Rentapagans are gay. They won't let Jesus come inside them.
ReplyDeletethere is obviously something funny about them, these freaks like to use Christ on the cross as some kind of homo-erotic theme, sickos. look at the cover art for this show, a female paired with a prancing shemale, hewitch type character, weirdos.
ReplyDeleteJesus was a cool dude. We was a Jew but he was a troofer like us. Sort of like a 2000 year old Bob Tuskin.
ReplyDeleteI LOL'd.
there is obviously something funny about them, these freaks like to use Christ on the cross as some kind of homo-erotic theme, sickos.
ReplyDeleteYou talking about Christians? I agree with you. And the whole "personal relationship with Jesus" smacks of homoeroticism too. Not to mention that Christians are described as "the bride of Christ" in the New Testament.
Creepy stuff, to be sure. Is it possible that Christianity started as some kind of Jewish homosexual cult? Possibly
Jesus Christ can forgive all you antisemites. He knows that you've just lost your way. God's chosen people gave us Christ. Why would you want to hurt them?
ReplyDelete12:15 PM
ReplyDeleteBut rubbing yourself in olive oil and fucking naked boys in the ass is ok, like greeks and romans used to do, right cause this is the pagan way.
Hail motherfuckin Jupiter and Holy Goat!
5:00 AM,
ReplyDeleteYou make a good point. I hadn't thought of it that way.
12:20 PM,
ReplyDeleteIt sounds like you're engaging in Jewdeo-Christian psychological projection again.
Take it in the ass. Or accept Jesus Christ. These are your options.
ReplyDelete12:19 PM,
ReplyDeleteI agree with you. We need to always remember that Jesus was descended from the Jewish people and the seed of Abraham. The Jewish people will always have a special place in G-D's heart, because he chose them from the beginning to bring light to this dark heathen world. We Christians are but merely grafted onto the tree of Israel, as St. Paul said in his epistles.
As Christians, we also need to reject the racist idea that Jews are a genetic or biological group. This kind of Nazi racist idea is totally against the teachings of Jesus and Paul in the New Testament.
ReplyDeleteJews need the saving grace of Jesus Christ just as all humans do. That is why we should be spreading the gospel message among the Jewish people just as we spread it among Africans, Asians, and Central Americans.
Thank you, Jesus.
12:30
ReplyDeleteStop pretending that your christian you faggot
Gay Marriage—Nothing New Under the Sun
ReplyDeleteMay 22, 2012
Gay marriage and homosexuality were part of the moral landscape faced by the first Christians in Ancient Rome.
Benjamin Wiker
Given that the gay marriage agenda will be increasingly pressed upon Catholics by the state, we should be much more aware of what history has to teach us about gay marriage—given that we don’t want to be among those who, ignorant of history, blithely condemned themselves to repeat it.
Contrary to the popular view—both among proponents and opponents—gay marriage is not a new issue. It cannot be couched (by proponents) as a seamless advance on the civil rights movement, nor should it be understood (by opponents) as something that’s evil merely because it appears to them to be morally unprecedented.
Gay marriage was—surprise!—alive and well in Rome, celebrated even and especially by select emperors, a spin-off of the general cultural affirmation of Roman homosexuality. Gay marriage was, along with homosexuality, something the first Christians faced as part of the pagan moral darkness of their time.
What Christians are fighting against today, then, is not yet another sexual innovation peculiar to our “enlightened age,” but the return to pre-Christian, pagan sexual morality.
So, what was happening in ancient Rome? Homosexuality was just as widespread among the Romans as it was among the Greeks (a sign of which is that it was condoned even by the stolid Stoics). The Romans had adopted the pederasty of the Greeks (aimed, generally, at boys between the ages of 12 to 18). There was nothing shameful about such sexual relations among Romans, if the boy was not freeborn. Slaves, both male and female, were considered property, and that included sexual property.
But the Romans also extended homosexuality to adult men, even adult free men. And it is likely that this crossing of the line from child to adult, unfree to free—not homosexuality as such—was what affronted the more austere of the Roman moralists.
And so we hear from Tacitus (56-117 AD), the great Roman historian, of the shameful sexual exploits of a string of Roman emperors from Tiberius to Nero. Nero was the first imperial persecutor of the Christians. His tutor and then advisor was the great Stoic moralist Seneca himself. Unfortunately, Seneca’s lessons must have bounced right off the future emperor. When he took the imperial seat, complete with its aura of self-proclaimed divinity, no trace of Stoic austerity remained.
In Nero, Tacitus tells the reader, tyrannical passion, the hubris of proclaimed divinity, the corruption of power, and “every filthy depraved act, licit or illicit” seemed to reach an imperial peak. He not only had a passion for “free-born boys” but also for quite literally marrying other men and even a boy, sometimes playing the part of the woman in the union and sometimes the man.
As Tacitus relates one incident (Grant’s translation): “Nero was already corrupted by every lust, natural and unnatural. But he now refuted any surmises that no further degradation was possible for him. For…he went through a formal wedding ceremony with one of the perverted gang called Pythagoras. The emperor, in the presence of witnesses, put on the bridal veil. Dowry, marriage bed, wedding torches, all were there. Indeed everything was public which even in a natural union is veiled by night.”
Such was only one instance. We also have from historian Seutonius, a contemporary of Tacitus, a report of Nero’s marriage to Doryphorus (who was himself married to another man, Sporus).
Hail Jesus and anti-racism! The Lord of all things Holy! All we have to do is turn the Jews towards Christ! Don't you see how simple it is?!
ReplyDeleteMartial, the first-century A.D. Roman poet, reports incidences of male-male marriage as kinds of perversions, but not uncommon perversions, speaking in one epigram (I.24) of a man who “played the bride yesterday.” In another (12.42) he says mockingly, “Bearded Callistratus gave himself in marriage to…Afer, in the manner in which a virgin usually gives herself in marriage to a male. The torches shone in front, the bridal veils covered his face, and wedding toasts were not absent, either. A dowry was also named. Does that not seem enough yet for you, Rome? Are you waiting for him to give birth?”
ReplyDeleteIn Juvenal’s Second Satire (117), we hear of one Gracchus, “arraying himself in the flounces and train and veil of a bride,” now a “new-made bride reclining on the bosom of her husband.” Such seems to have been the usual way of male-male nuptials among the Romans, one of the men actually dressing up as a woman and playing the part of a woman.
12:33
ReplyDeleteThanks for the jewish propaganda. With no source. Let me guess, Wikipedia? Or a christian site?
The notoriously debauched emperor Elagabalus (ruled 218-222) married and then divorced five women. But he considered his male chariot driver to be his “husband,” and he also married one Zoticus, an athlete. Elagabalus loved to dress up as a queen, quite literally.
ReplyDeleteOur reports of homosexual marriage from Rome give us, I hope, a clearer understanding of what is at stake. As is the case today, it appears that the incidence of male-male marriage followed upon the widespread acceptance of homosexuality; that is, the practice of homosexuality led to the notion that, somehow, homosexual unions should share in the same status as heterosexual unions.
We must also add that heterosexuality among the Romans was also in a sad state. Both concubinage and prostitution were completely acceptable; pornography and sexually explicit entertainment and speech were entirely normalized; the provision of sex by both male and female slaves was considered a duty by masters. Paeans to the glory of marriage were made, not because the Romans had some proto-Christian notion of the sanctity of marriage, but because Rome needed more citizen-soldiers just when the Romans were depopulating themselves by doing anything to avoid having children.
The heterosexual moral disrepair in Rome therefore formed the social basis for the Roman slide into homosexual marriage rites. We hear of them from critics bent on satirizing such unions. The problem for the Romans wasn’t homosexuality as such, but that a Roman man would debase himself and play the part of a woman in matrimony
Christians had a problem with the whole Roman sexual scene. We are, of course, not surprised to find that the first Christians accepted and carried forward the strict rejection of homosexuality inherent in Judaism, but this was part of its more encompassing rejection of any sexuality outside of heterosexual, monogamous marriage. Christians are not to be lauded for affirming that marriage must be defined as a union of a man and a woman, because that is the natural default of any people intent on not disappearing in a single generation. What was peculiar to Christianity (again, not just following Judaism, but intensifying it) was the restriction of sexuality only to monogamous, heterosexual marriage.
ReplyDeleteThe Christians found themselves in a pagan culture where there were few restrictions on sexuality at all, other than the imagination—a culture that, to note the obvious but exceedingly important, looks suspiciously like ours.
The first-century A.D. catechetical manual, the Didache, makes refreshingly clear what pagans will have to give up, in regard to Roman sexuality, once they entered the Church. It begins with the ominous words, “There are two ways: one of life and one of death—and there is a great difference between the two ways.” The pagan converts are then confronted with a list of commands. Some of which would have been quite familiar and reasonable to Romans, such as, “You will not murder” and, “You will not commit adultery” (although for Romans, abortion wasn’t murder, and a husband having sex with slaves or prostitutes was not considered adulterous).
But then followed strange commands (at least to the Romans), “You will not corrupt boys”; “You will not have illicit sex” (ou porneuseis); “You will not murder offspring by means of abortion [and] you will not kill one having been born.” Against the norm in Rome, Christians must reject pedophilia, fornication and homosexuality, abortion, and infanticide. The list also commands, “You will not make potions” (ou pharmakeuseis), a prohibition against widespread practices in the Roman Empire which included potions that stopped conception or caused abortion.
I include the prohibitions against sexual practices heartily affirmed by the Romans alongside prohibitions against contraception, abortion, and infanticide for a very important reason. Christians defined the goal of sexuality in terms of the natural ability to procreate. What was different, again, was not recognizing the obvious need for a man and a woman to make a child—Stoics argued along the same lines. What was peculiar to Christianity was removing all other expressions of sexuality from legitimacy (many Stoic men had male paramours). The Roman elevation of sexual pleasure above procreation, and hence outside this tightly-defined area of sexual legitimacy defined by Christianity, led to the desire for contraceptive potions, abortifacients, and infanticide.
It also led to seeing marriage as nothing but an arena for sexual pleasure, which in turn allowed for an equivalency of heterosexual and homosexual marriage.
The Theodosian Code, drawn up by Christian emperors in the fifth century, A.D. made same-sex marriage illegal (referring, as precedent, to edicts published under fourth-century emperors Constantius II and Constans).
We can see, then, that Christians face nothing new in regard to the push for gay marriage. In fact, it is something quite old, and represents a return to the pagan views of sexuality that dominated the Roman Empire into which Christianity was born.
wow, you freaks are weird, so which one is the woman, or do you take turns
ReplyDelete12:33, 12:38
ReplyDeleteThe person who wrote your precious fag pagan essay is a christian crypto-jew. All you christians do is lie for your own jewish agenda. You're nothing but pathetic propagandists.
12:41, 12:42
ReplyDeleteMore trash written by a crypto-jewish christian. Of course christard spammer would use it as a source. He has to project the stereotype of closet gay christians onto pagans in order to make his bad thoughts of boy butts go away.
ReplyDeletePagans and Marriage Equality
Jason Pitzl-Waters — March 27, 2013 — 5 Comments
We likely won’t know until June what the outcomes of the oral arguments at the Supreme Court over California’s Proposition 8 and the Defense of Marriage Act (DOMA) will be, but it does seem clear that a threshold has been crossed. No matter how narrow (or broad) the decisions will ultimately be regarding the rights of same-sex couples in the United States, many will look to 2013 (and the November 2012 elections) as a time when a cultural corner was turned. When marriage equality was now backed by a majority of Americans, when politicians quickly issue statements to be on the right side of history, and when culturally conservative opponents of same-sex marriage are collapsing.
“In 2004, the campaign to prevent gay marriage was in its heyday. The Bush administration had seeded an initiative banning gay marriage in Ohio to mobilize activists and peel off traditionalist Democratic voters. Democrats nationally were running for cover, and even Howard Dean’s pro-civil-unions stance appeared risky. Now the movement is in a state of total collapse, with every day seeming to bring new converts to the gay-marriage cause and the opposition losing all of its courage.”
For many years Pagans have been on the forefront of the marriage equality debate. As a decentralized movement, one that recognizes many different sources of authority and tradition, we have long accepted that same-sex rites (and rights) were a part of our larger tapestry. As thousands gathered in Washington DC to be a part of history of the making, modern Pagans were there too, adding our voices, our support, to the growing movement for full equality.
“On March 26th and 27th, two of the most historic cases to ever be heard by the Supreme Court of the United States will begin. One case would overturn Proposition 8, which years ago banned marriage equality for all same-sex California citizens. The second trial would overturn DOMA (the so-called “Defense of Marriage Act”). Depending on how the SCOTUS rules, both of these trials could have major nation-wide effects that would change the course of our movement forever. People from all over the country will be arriving here in the District to rally at the trial on Tuesday. A crew of people (including me) will be sleeping outside on the sidewalk of the Supreme Court on Monday night before the rally on Tuesday. That night I will facilitate a ritual calling upon the guardian Goddess of DC and of the United States, Columbia. We will ask Columbia to bring the sword of victory to our work, leading us in the march to freedom and justice. Before the Tuesday rally, I’ll attend an interfaith service with some of my of my coreligionists and people of other faiths. Rev. Selena Fox of Circle Sanctuary will be speaking at the service to give a voice from the Pagan perspective. This is all a very big deal.”
ReplyDeleteAs we get closer to decisions in these cases I plan to showcase Pagan voices on this issue, including national Pagan organizations, activists on the ground, and the experiences of Pagan same-sex couples. Until then, here’s a selection of past coverage The Wild Hunt has done on marriage equality, which includes many important Pagan voices weighing in on the subject.
ReplyDeleteDOMA Ruling and Pagan Marriage Rites (October 2012)
“A truly pluralistic and secular government understands that allowing one religious paradigm concerning marriage to trump all others is wrong, and undermines the very rights a free society holds sacred. We no longer live in a solely Christian nation, nor did we ever, really, from the very beginning America was built on a dance of power and privilege that sought to establish dominance for one viewpoint. That can no longer stand, and today’s ruling is not only a positive step forward for the rights of same-sex couples, but is also a step forward for all those who would want to bless those unions.”
Christianity and Marriage Equality (May 2012)
“As a non-Christian I have become increasingly frustrated with the game of theological and political ”hot potato” when it comes to this issue. It’s always “those” Christians over there, not the “good” Christians who are “evolving” on the issue. When the Catholic Pope calls for a grand anti-gay-marriage religious coalition, when our country’s most popular Evangelical leader defends himself from the mere perception of tolerance, you simply can’t pretend that opposition to the basic humanity of LGBTQ individuals is some extremist fringe living in the wilderness. The real, unfortunate, truth is that Christianity is working against the lives of gay men and women, save for a small percentage who have broken away.”
On Faith: Is there a marriage crisis in America today? (December 2010)
“It’s telling that the “solution” provided by many to the marriage problem is to roll back freedoms, and enshrine a trapped-in-amber definition of marriage that is as much an artificial construction as any now criticized by the culture warriors. Just as many “traditional marriage” proponents would blanch at the thought of returning marriage to a time of dowries, land transference, political alliances, and women-as-bargaining-chip; so too do young people today recoil at the thought of marriage being limited to the “proper” genders, a vehicle for reproduction, social stability, and maintaining an illusory status quo. A return to a time when private detectives where required to extricate oneself from an unhappy union, and domestic abuses were glossed over for the sake of social order.”
Pagans and Prop. 8 (August 2012)
“Within modern Pagan communities same-sex marriage is almost wholly uncontroversial. Shortly after Walker’s ruling was handed down, several Pagan organizations and noted figures within the movement reaffirmed their commitment to same-sex marriages and praised the decision. Druid group Ar nDriaocht Fein (ADF) said in a statement they “warmly welcome the decision of the court”, and that their organization has “never believed that the institution of marriage could possibly be threatened by the existence of married people of any gender”. T. Thorn Coyle of Solar Cross Temple and Morningstar Mystery School, speaking to those now recoiling from Prop. 8′s overturn, noted that“we are not trying to change your religious beliefs. We are only saying that we have the same civil rights as you do.” Holli Emore of Osireion and the Pagan Round Table said in a message to The Wild Hunt that we are “living in the last days of the kind of bigotry that would presume to dictate such matters, in my opinion.”
paganism is gayyyyyyyyyyyy
ReplyDelete12:53,12:54
ReplyDeleteMore anti-pagan trash written by a jew? You're desperate aren't you?
Jews are God's chosen people. They gave us Jesus. If they say that all pagans were faggots then we have the obligation to believe them.
ReplyDeletewhere is the proof the Christian is a jew? you've allready been told the antichristian/pagan movement is jewish, so you shouldn't be surprised that it is full of jews and homos
ReplyDeleteIf you're not a moron and can tell a jew by looking at one, look at a picture of him. Even if you deny the obvious features, he's still a spiritual jew and a biased opinion. Of course he's going to say pagans were gay until they were saved.
ReplyDeleteBut you're right, the anti-christ movement is run by jews, just like christianity. They always control both sides. If they didn't control the anti-christ movement then people might start showing how christianity is a jewish hoax. So they make it an anti-upper-class pro-fag movement to discredit anti-christianity. Real pagans are anti-fag so they have to make it look the opposite. Most of the so-called pagans that are pro-fag are just marxist scum that got brainwashed by jewish new-age garbage.
so now anyone you say is a jew, is a jew. you know what happens to retards like you? you end up killing yourselves, accusing each other of being jewish.
ReplyDeleteIm telling you, only solution is to kill all christians, because they're permanently brainwashed by the kike rabbi insanity.
ReplyDeleteJason Pitzl-Waters, while though he has a cool radio show, is a Liberal and a Wiccan. He doesn't represent the whole of paganry.
ReplyDeleteWiccad!
ReplyDeletePitzl-Waters is a jew. And a faggot.
ReplyDeleteIm a christian businessman and i think you're all evil.
ReplyDeleteYou aren't a real christian because you're supposed to give EVERYTHING you make to the poor. Or else you're a satanist. Read the bible. You aren't a true follower of Christ.
ReplyDeleteJohn Alan Martinson Jr - War On Christ
ReplyDeletehttp://trutube.tv/video/1045/War-On-Christ#
Using the word conspiracy theorists all the time makes you sound like the jew Rachel madow. You are alienating white nationalists who do believe in conspiracies. What do you think all this race mixing is? It is a conspiracy. So to be able to convince millions of white women to take black cocks, you have to be very clever. So why couldn't people that clever also shoot up schools and blame it on whites? And calling people who believe in conspiracies muzzie lovers? You look really ignorant acting that way and it taints and discredits some of your good material to a degree.
ReplyDeleteGuys, Kike Delaney's nigger partner said there's a war on Christ. It must be true. Its on TruTube.
ReplyDeleteForget your silly-willy conspiracies that jews created Christ. You faggots.
Mike Deleney announced that trutube is now open to advertizers. That is positive example of being christian businessman.
ReplyDeletewow, you people really chimp out on that delaney guy, zcf must look really good in a dress.
ReplyDeleteIf he doesn't give all the proceeds to the poor then he isn't a real christian. It says so in the Bible, the word of The Lord.
ReplyDeleteAtleast Delaney can make some cash now. He won't have to steal anyone's car anymore.
ReplyDeleteAt least he is really doing something, instead of bitching on the internet.
ReplyDeleteProject Off The Grid. Liberty Village
http://www.projectoffthegrid.com/
http://trutube.tv/video/1718/Project-Off-The-Grid-2
Anonymous said...
ReplyDeleteStop pretending that your christian you faggot
April 30, 2013 at 12:33 PM
Jesus loves you too child even though you are a hypocrite. Jesus is love. Jesus forgives. Jesus knows that calling people faggots is ok because you are just a sinner for your entire life on earth and nothing more. Your father will still accept you into His heaven though child so worry not that you are just a mere sinner and must live your whole life on earth in sin. One day you will come in Heaven with your father and his son. This will be your reward for a life of sin & servitude while alive on this earth. Amen!
Christian Right Bigots Are Hiding the Truth -- Early Christians Condoned Gay Marriage
ReplyDeleteMany of the world's religions -- including Christianity -- supported same-sex unions, a reality obscured by modern-day shrill, conservative commentary.
August 22, 2010 |
Through much of history, especially prior to the Fourteenth Century, many Christians did not share the view that marriage was a reward for being heterosexual, nor that a same-sex union was objectionable.
An icon from St. Catherine’s monastery on Mount Sinai illustrates this point. It shows two robed Christian saints getting married. Their pronubus (official witness, or “best man”) is none other than Jesus Christ.
It is a standard Roman portrayal of a wedding. The difference: the two saints are both male, Fourth Century Christian martyrs, Saint Serge and Saint Bacchus, close friends in the Roman army who were purportedly singled out for their secret adherence to Christianity before being tortured and killed.
Their unity, considered romantic by some historians and depicted through the image of marriage at St. Catherine’s monastery, was commemorated in many subsequent liturgies. The late Yale historian John Boswell found evidence for other Christian same-sex marriage ceremonies continuing even into the Eighteenth Century.
It is broadly and falsely assumed that the world’s religions uniformly condemn same-sex unions. That error is even repeated in the recent favorable decision on same-sex marriage by Chief Judge of Federal District Court in San Francisco, Vaughan R. Walker.
It is true that all major religions exhibit some heterosexism, a bias in favor of heterosexuality over homosexuality. However, religions also have shown openness to same-sex unions, a reality that shrill conservative commentary, which dominates the public square on matters religious and sexual, has blocked from public view, even from the view of Judge Walker.
Conservative Christians who swarm onto center stage in the current debates cite the anti-gay texts from the Bible, but even they do not take those passages seriously since the texts call for capital punishment for active gays. Not even the Tea Party folk favor that.
Leviticus says that anyone who has sex with someone of the same sex “shall be put to death: their blood shall be on their own heads.” (Leviticus 20:13) Paul writing to the Romans says those who do such things “deserve to die.” (1:26-32).
These isolated texts – like other biblical passages permitting slavery, animal sacrifice and polygamy – are not applicable to today, though they continue to do mischief in modern churches and in the chambers of lawmakers.
These passages also run counter to Jesus’s teachings in the gospels where he defends the persecuted, including those accused of sexual offenses, famously demanding of Israelites who were preparing to stone to death an alleged adulteress that “he that is without sin among you, let him cast the first stone at her.”
That tolerance, often in the face of cruel intolerance, guided many early believers in Christianity. And, like early Christianity, other world religions have demonstrated tolerance toward same-sex unions.
Many Buddhist authorities insist that privileging one sexual orientation over another is not the path of wisdom and insist that the successful management of sexual desire is the moral issue, not the orientation of that desire or the gender of your lover.
Jewish scholars show that compulsory hetero-normativity is not supported by basic Jewish values.
Is the icon suggesting that a
ReplyDeletehomosexual or same sex marriage
is one sanctified by Christ?
The very idea seems initially shocking. The full answer comes from other sources about the two men featured, St. Serge and St. Bacchus, two Roman soldiers who became Christian martyrs.
While the pairing of saints, particularly in the early church, was not unusual, the association of these two men was regarded as particularly close. Severus of Antioch in the sixth century explained that "we should not separate in speech [Serge and Bacchus] who were joined in life." More bluntly, in the definitive 10th century Greek account of their lives, St. Serge is openly described as the "sweet companion and lover" of St. Bacchus.
Professor John Boswell's
Startling Discovery
The very idea of a Christian gay marriage seems incredible. Yet after a twelve year search of Catholic and Orthodox church archives Yale history professor John Boswell has discovered that a type of Christian gay marriage did exist as late as the 18th century.
Contrary to myth, Christianity's concept of marriage has not been set in stone since the days of Christ, but has evolved as a concept and as a ritual.
Professor Boswell discovered that in addition to heterosexual marriage ceremonies in ancient church liturgical documents (and clearly separate from other types of non-marital blessings of adopted children or land) were ceremonies called, among other titles, the "Office of Same Sex Union" (10th and 11th century Greek) or the "Order for Uniting Two Men" (11th and 12th century). That certainly sounds like gay marriage.
The ceremonies Boswell describes
had all the contemporary symbols
of a marriage.
A community gathered in a church
A blessing of the couple before the altar
Their right hands joined as at heterosexual marriages
The participation of a priest
The taking of the Eucharist
A wedding banquet afterwards
All of these are shown in contemporary drawings of the same sex union of Byzantine Emperor Basil I (867-886) and his companion John. Such homosexual unions also took place in Ireland in the late 12th to early 13th century, as the chronicler Gerald of Wales (Geraldus Cambrensis) has recorded.
Dr. Boswell lists in detail some same sex union ceremonies found in ancient church liturgical documents.
One Greek 13th century "Order for Solemnization of Same Sex Union," having invoked St. Serge and St. Bacchus, called on God to
"vouchsafe unto these Thy servants grace to love another and to abide unhated and not cause of scandal all the days of their lives, with the help of the Holy Mother of God and all Thy saints." The ceremony concludes: "And they shall kiss the Holy Gospel and each other, and it shall be concluded."
Another 14th century Serbian Slavonic "Office of the Same Sex Union," uniting two men or two women, had the couple having their right hands laid on the Gospel while having a cross placed in their left hands. Having kissed the Gospel, the couple were then required to kiss each other, after which the priest, having raised up the Eucharist, would give them both communion.
Ancient marriage records can be found
ReplyDeletein libraries across Europe.
Boswell found records of same sex unions in such diverse archives as those in the Vatican, in St. Petersburg, in Paris, Istanbul, and in Sinai, covering a period from the 8th to 18th centuries. Nor is he the first to make such a discovery. The Dominican Jacques Goar (1601-1653) includes such ceremonies in a printed collection of Greek prayer books.
While homosexuality was technically illegal from late Roman times, it was only from about the 14th century that anti-homosexual feelings swept western Europe. Yet same sex unions continued to take place.
At St. John Lateran in Rome (traditionally the Pope's parish church) in 1578,
as many as 13 couples were "married" at Mass with the apparent cooperation of the local clergy, "taking communion together, using the same nuptial Scripture, after which they slept and ate together," according to a contemporary report.
If you meet a guy who's really into Christianity they're usually very effeminate. It's a religion that spurs women and has men worship a Jewish pansy.And don't even get me started on the priests.
ReplyDeleteIf there were efforts to criminalize homosexual behavior in the church it was probably because it was too rampant.
Tacitus explained how the Germanic pagans threw homosexuals into bogs, and the myths about Greek and Roman practices are unfounded. The myths are perpetrated by Jews and homosexuals. Most likely closeted ones at that.
http://homosexualityinancientgreece.wordpress.com/
As the title states this little blog is all about a myth, the myth of homosexuality in ancient Hellas. Here we’ll be debunking common lies related to Hellenic history. Lies promoted by those that try to legitimize their sexual preference by connecting it to the greatness of the Hellenic civilization.
I should note that I of course acknowledge that homosexuality existed in ancient Hellas, just as it has existed, and will continue to exist, everywhere and at all times in human history. However, while it did exist, it was never legally sanctioned, thought to be a cultural norm nor engaged in without risk of serious punishment, which included exile and death.
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aHk9JoXoBMY
April 30, 2013 at 3:21 PM
ReplyDeleteProject Off The Grid. Liberty Village
Wow, a bunch of CI freaks living in a compound in the woods somewhere?
That can't be sketchy at all...
*cough* Elohim city*cough*
151 AD Justin Martyr "[W]e have been taught that to expose newly-born children is the part of wicked men; and this we have been taught lest we should do anyone harm and lest we should sin against God, first, because we see that almost all so exposed (not only the girls, but also the males) are brought up to prostitution. And for this pollution a multitude of females and hermaphrodites, and those who commit unmentionable iniquities, are found in every nation. And you receive the hire of these, and duty and taxes from them, whom you ought to exterminate from your realm. And any one who uses such persons, besides the godless and infamous and impure intercourse, may possibly be having intercourse with his own child, or relative, or brother. And there are some who prostitute even their own children and wives, and some are openly mutilated for the purpose of sodomy; and they refer these mysteries to the mother of the gods" (First Apology 27).
ReplyDelete181 AD Theophilus of Antioch "Give studious attention to the prophetic writings [the Bible] and they will lead you on a clearer path to escape the eternal punishments and to obtain the eternal good things of God.. [God] will examine everything and will judge justly, granting recompense to each according to merit. To those who seek immortality by the patient exercise of good works, he will give everlasting life, joy, peace, rest, and all good things.. For the unbelievers and for the contemptuous, and for those who do not submit to the truth but assent to iniquity, when they have been involved in adulteries, and fornications, and homosexualities, and avarice, and in lawless idolatries, there will be wrath and indignation, tribulation and anguish; and in the end, such men as these will be detained in everlasting fire" (To Autolycus 1:14).
ReplyDeleteIf you meet a guy who's really into Christianity they're usually very effeminate. It's a religion that spurs women and has men worship a Jewish pansy.
ReplyDeleteThis is very true. In fact, the New Testament commands men to castrate themselves and to avoid women, marriage, and family life.
190 AD Clement of Alexandria "All honor to that king of the Scythians, whoever Anacharsis was, who shot with an arrow one of his subjects who imitated among the Scythians the mystery of the mother of the gods . . . condemning him as having become effeminate among the Greeks, and a teacher of the disease of effeminacy to the rest of the Scythians" ... [According to Greek myth] Baubo [a female native of Elusis] having received [the goddess] Demeter hospitably, reached to her a refreshing draught; and on her refusing it, not having any inclination to drink (for she was very sad), and Baubo having become annoyed, thinking herself slighted, uncovered her shame, and exhibited her nudity to the goddess. Demeter is delighted with the sight--pleased, I repeat, at the spectacle. These are the secret mysteries of the Athenians; these Orpheus records" ... "It is not, then, without reason that the poets call him [Hercules] a cruel wretch and a nefarious scoundrel. It were tedious to recount his adulteries of all sorts, and debauching of boys. For your gods did not even abstain from boys, one having loved Hylas, another Hyacinthus, another Pelops, another Chrysippus, another Ganymede. Let such gods as these be worshipped by your wives, and let them pray that their husbands be such as these--so temperate; that, emulating them in the same practices, they may be like the gods. Such gods let your boys be trained to worship, that they may grow up to be men with the accursed likeness of fornication on them received from the gods" (Exhortation to the Greeks 2).
ReplyDelete220AD Tertullian "[A]ll other frenzies of the lusts which exceed the laws of nature, and are impious toward both [human] bodies and the sexes, we banish, not only from the threshold but also from all shelter of the Church, for they are not sins so much as monstrosities" (Modesty 4).
ReplyDelete7:25 PM
ReplyDeleteAnd next you paste long articles from jewish sources about christian wars and atrocities of crucaders. You can't have it in both ways, faggot.
253 AD Cyprian of Carthage "[T]urn your looks to the abominations, not less to be deplored, of another kind of spectacle . . . Men are emasculated, and all the pride and vigor of their sex is effeminated in the disgrace of their enervated body; and he is more pleasing there who has most completely broken down the man into the woman. He grows into praise by virtue of his crime; and the more he is degraded, the more skillful he is considered to be. Such a one is looked upon--oh shame!--and looked upon with pleasure. . . . nor is there wanting authority for the enticing abomination . . . that Jupiter of theirs [is] not more supreme in dominion than in vice, inflamed with earthly love in the midst of his own thunders . . . now breaking forth by the help of birds to violate the purity of boys. And now put the question: Can he who looks upon such things be healthy-minded or modest? Men imitate the gods whom they adore, and to such miserable beings their crimes become their religion" (Letters 1:8).
ReplyDeleteAll of the Christians I know are pretty masculine married men. It's easy to spot a pagan with their ear and nose rings.
ReplyDeleteBoswell was made full professor in 1982. In 1987, Boswell helped organize and found the Lesbian and Gay Studies Center at Yale, which is now the Research Fund for Lesbian and Gay Studies.
ReplyDeleteThis guys a peter puffer
Wow, I had no idea that the Catholic and Orthodox church sanctioned gay marriages for 1,000 years.
ReplyDeleteThanks for the info.
Now I know this stupid "gay marriage" issue is just another red herring that Jews put out there in the cultural sphere to distract the simple minded White American conservatard Christians, just like the "abortion" issue.
Very clever, Jews.
This guys a peter puffer
ReplyDeleteAnd apparently, so are a lot of Christians, historic and current.
Well all the Church leaders today are saying all that shit meanwhile they're giving the choir boys a good go, what makes these guys any different? It's a pretty good cover I guess. The church leaders had full control of peoples minds and bodies. Most of the time they were perverts and at a much higher rate then Pagans. Look at the Borgia. Or King James and Richard Lionheart... two of the top Christian Europeans in history.
ReplyDeletehttp://bishop-accountability.org/priestdb/PriestDBbylastName-A.html
Child brides:
http://www.answering-christianity.com/byzantine_child_brides.htm
April 30, 2013 at 7:43 PM
ReplyDeleteIt was the European people that stopped it. By framing it as a Christian issue, it happens to get through. Fancy that.
391 AD John Chrysostom "All of these affections [in Rom. 1:26-27] . . . were vile, but chiefly the mad lust after males; for the soul is more the sufferer in sins, and more dishonored than the body in diseases" ... "[The men] have done an insult to nature itself. And a yet more disgraceful thing than these is it, when even the women seek after these intercourses, who ought to have more shame than men" ... "And sundry other books of the philosophers one may see full of this disease. But we do not therefore say that the thing was made lawful, but that they who received this law were pitiable, and objects for many tears. For these are treated in the same way as women that play the whore. Or rather their plight is more miserable. For in the case of the one the intercourse, even if lawless, is yet according to nature; but this is contrary both to law and nature. For even if there were no hell, and no punishment had been threatened, this would be worse than any punishment" (Homilies on Romans 4).
ReplyDeleteI think the fact that the Catholic church and Eastern Orthodox church gave official sanction to homosexual marriages for the better part of a thousand years is proof that Christians are completely full of shit on the issue of gay marriage.
ReplyDelete7:44 PM, that's true. I almost forgot the fact that most Catholic priests are homosexual pedophiles.
ReplyDeleteIt seems that the Christian church is the place to be if you want to hide your homosexuality and pederasty.
You can make up lies about Christianity, or quote people who make up lies, quotes from church leaders don't lie. Christianity has always been anti-gay. Not only were pagans gay, their gods were gay.
ReplyDelete390 AD John Chrysostom "[The pagans] were addicted to the love of boys, and one of their wise men made a law that pederasty . . . should not be allowed to slaves, as if it was an honorable thing; and they had houses for this purpose, in which it was openly practiced. And if all that was done among them was related, it would be seen that they openly outraged nature, and there was none to restrain them. . . . As for their passion for boys, whom they called their 'paedica,' it is not fit to be named" (Homilies on Titus 5).
ReplyDeleteMAMI'S SHIT!
ReplyDeleteITS ALL SHIT, SHIT, SHIT!
THIS COMMENT SECTION IS A REAL CESSPOOL OF MENTAL MASTURBATION.
April 30, 2013 at 7:51 PM
ReplyDeleteBut all the church leaders were gay closet cases
April 30, 2013 at 7:52 PM
ReplyDeleteJohn Chrysostom was a rabid anti pagan, he did everything he could do support people who burned down pagan shrines and openly campaigned for it.
So basically he's most likely bullshitting here.
He also got exile for being a communist. He also hated women so he was prob a pillow biter himself too. Heh.
11:23 PM
ReplyDeleteIf you look at fact, which you don't, it looks like the whole roman empire was degenerate, kind of like today. The pagan religions were the cutting edge of this degeneracy, kind of like today. Great Christian leaders, like Chrysostom got rid of the degeneracy. Not only was Chrysostom a rabid anti-pagan, he was also a rabid anti-jew.
The same thing is going to happen here, or it won't, pick your side. Personally, I'd like to see all of you scumbags burnt at the stake.
May 1, 2013 at 12:43 AM
ReplyDeleteWhere'd you hear that man, the history channel? Right after the show about how Hitler was an evil pagan and killed 6 million Jews?
Give me a break.
And that John guy only said Jews and Christians shouldn't mingle which was the Jewish creed not the Christian one. They wanted to sit in there ghettos and not have the goy around.
2:08 AM
ReplyDeletebelieve what you want, antichristian/pagans are swell folks, have fun, just stay the fuck away from me.
"I think the fact that the Catholic church and Eastern Orthodox church gave official sanction to homosexual marriages for the better part of a thousand years is proof that Christians are completely full of shit on the issue of gay marriage.
ReplyDeleteApril 30, 2013 at 7:46 PM"
HAHAHAHAA, this is pure gold! :DDDD
No wonder whole world laughs at America.
God hates pagans!
ReplyDeletequotes from church leaders don't lie.
ReplyDeleteLOL
Right. The church fathers never lied or made stuff up. No, of course not. Even though the entire New Testament is one giant hoax.
You "pro-white" Christards are a real hoot. Keep up the comedy routine.
12:43 AM,
ReplyDeleteChristianity didn't become popular and spread until Roman society started to collapse.
Isn't that interesting?
We surely must all now know at least some of the plentiful grotesqueries contained in the Bible as highlighted in the c19th onwards in publications like the "Bible Handbook" (Foote and Ball).
ReplyDeleteWhat would be a step further is some research / ideas on who promoted the uptake of Christianity in Western European kingdoms and principalities after the fall of Rome.
How did the English and Irish monks have the money and other resources to support their proselytising journeys spreading the 'Good News'?
In medieval times wasn't it actually forbidden by canon or even secular law for the laity to read the Bible, assuming they even could read?
Why at the time of the 'Enlightenment' were measures of secular law in place to enforce Sunday observance, not just in terms of church attendance but in restrictions on drinking in taverns, commercial activity etc?
All this and the other reasons that a moment's reflection could produce indicate the enforcement of belief as control system.
Flavio Barbiero - Secret Society of Moses - any cred.?
Were the expulsions e.g. from England in 1290 total and complete, or in fact were royal advisers mysteriously exempted from the purges?